This transcript is AI generated, and includes boo boos. Just sayin'.
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Speaker 1 (00:00:00) - Welcome to Uncopyable women in Sales. If you're looking for actionable insights in real world tools to turbocharge your sales starting tomorrow, well, you're in the right place. Your host, Kay Miller, earned the affectionate nickname Muffler Mama when she sold more automotive mufflers than anyone else in the world. In this podcast, Kay will talk to another superstar women in sales, as they reveal un copyable strategies you can use to rack up more leads, snag dream clients, and take your sales numbers through the roof. Stay tuned and get ready to make more sales. And how about this more money?
Speaker 2 (00:00:40) - Today I have the pleasure of talking with Brynne Tillman. Brynne is a LinkedIn sales trainer and coach. She teaches professionals how to leverage LinkedIn to start trust based conversations without being salesy. Brynne's authentic approach to social selling has led her to receive a LinkedIn top voice in multiple categories. She's the best selling author of the LinkedIn sales playbook, and is most proud of the sales result that she and her team have enabled their clients to achieve.
Speaker 2 (00:01:17) - Brynne, welcome to the podcast. Well, thanks for having me. I'm so excited to be here. I have followed you on LinkedIn for quite a while, but then recently I was on Jack rants with Modern Bakers, a podcast that you team up with Jack Hubbard on, and I was very fascinated. He's a great guy. You guys have great chemistry. You must have a lot of fun. Oh, we have a blast. We really do. So, you know, he's such a cool guy. I ended up actually also interviewing his daughter, Erin Aaron McCann, and she. That was a very fun interview., tons of great information. But today we're going to talk about how our listeners, women in sales and some men in sales,, can approach sales, you know, and getting more prospects and customers on LinkedIn, like you said, without being salesy. So why don't we just jump in and you can start telling us where to start? Yeah. Well, the first thing is I just want to.
Speaker 3 (00:02:22) - Review there are kind of like five buckets of social selling. The first one is social listening and research. Right. And that one actually overreaches into every other area in social selling. We need to understand our clients, our clients company, their industry, their clients, industry trends that are happening, what matters to them., if we don't, we don't matter to them. Connecting with someone on with a good context is not about selling them or stuff. It's about having a conversation around what matters to them. So we don't know that without our social listening. So that that's sort of that overarching first category or bucket number two is the profile. Your LinkedIn profile is your professional landing page. This should not be your resume. If you're in sales, that should be a resource. The goal of your profile here is to earn you the right to get the conversation, which ultimately is the goal of social selling to get the conversation. So your profile needs to resonate with your buyer. Create curiosity and teach them something new that gets them thinking a little differently about the way that they're doing things today, so that they're engaged enough to have a compelling moment which could be a connection.
Speaker 3 (00:03:50) - Request a connection, accept a message, engaging on content. But we're moving them. And actually your profile in content is is positioned to do this, but you're moving them from lurker to engage or from just hanging out to to engaging. If we don't do that, we don't know who they are and we can't start a conversation and there's no sales without a conversation. So that's number two. Number three is the content piece. And content has three legs. There's first there's the,, curating content, finding content that matters to your prospect. That is absolutely essential that they understand that their industry or their clients, industry or the trends that are happening is important to you because that's what's important to them, not sharing your products and your services. That is not context for them yet, right? So that curation is really important. Creation is also important, but creation no longer has to be a full blown blog post. It's a quote. It's a pole. It's an image., you know, there are so many things that we can do on LinkedIn.
Speaker 3 (00:05:02) - A quick little video tip, a slider e-book, right? Like there's so many things that we could do that's not blogging on LinkedIn. And now with the amazing we talked about this a little bit earlier., okay. The ChatGPT allows us to take a little bit of content and create tons of content. So we can definitely talk about that, but that definitely pulls in that fabulous content bucket. The third thing under content is engaging, which, by the way, is as important as anything else that we recommend that you engage ten times for every post so that you're out there commenting and engaging on other people's stuff. Because guess what? That's what matters the most to them. There is not a piece of content in the world that's going to matter to them more than you, engaging on the content they share. Now, not everyone is sharing content, so that's not across the board. It's not like the easiest way to get on their radar. However, if they are sharing content, on average a person is getting seven touches to their content.
Speaker 3 (00:06:08) - That means seven reactions slash comments, period. That's all they're getting. So you will stand out. It's just amazing right? So that's the engaging okay. So we we talked about social listening profile and content. Number four is nurturing your connections. We tend to go in and connect with lots of people. The average person now it's over 1200 average connections on LinkedIn. It used to be 500. So we've more than doubled since before the pandemic. Like 1200 people on average. 10% of our connections are people we should be having conversations with that we're ignoring. That's 120 on average is 120 people in our network that we would be we would love to be on a conversation with, yeah, we forgot we even connected with them. So we've got to nurture them and content helps us to do that as well. And number five, absolutely. Why I teach this I teach LinkedIn and social selling over sales. I was a sales trainer is one more market. We want to make sure we are leveraging our clients connections and our networking partner connections to identify who they know that we want to meet.
Speaker 3 (00:07:21) - And really, you know, I hate to say it both ways. They should use us too, but leverage one another's network to get introductions and to our targeted buyers. That's the big overarching picture. That was a lot. I'm sorry, I know I love it and.
Speaker 2 (00:07:37) - I love it. It's it's good stuff. It I it brings up so many questions to me., as we talked about the ChatGPT thing, I want to ask you about that more, as far as profile, I'll start with that. One. Is there one specific thing that you that someone listening could do right now to improve their profile? Yeah.
Speaker 3 (00:07:56) - So switch your about section from about your mission, your passion, your yours and business. Take all of that. Move it down into your experience and make that about section about your buyer. So start with here's the challenge most of my buyers are facing today. Here are some valuable insights to get them thinking differently and learning new things where they go wow, I haven't thought of it that way before and then say, this is how we help.
Speaker 3 (00:08:28) - If you're if you're exploring this, let's chat. And now all of a sudden. Our about section is a resource that are just the right to get the conversation. I cannot tell you in in so many different forms on almost a weekly basis, someone will connect with me and schedule a call with me. And I'll always ask, typically at the beginning, but sometimes I forget and so I ask it then, oh, by the way, how did you find me? Or what triggered this conversation today? And inevitably, at least once a week, I'm getting someone that says, well, you know, I was reading your profile and I thought, man, if I could learn that much here, imagine what a phone call with you would be. And so I, I wanted to schedule that phone call. And because my link to my calendar is in many, many places, it's easy for people to do.
Speaker 2 (00:09:24) - That's that's really good. My book is on Copyable sales secrets, and we talk about your primary target, your very ideal target market as being your moose.
Speaker 2 (00:09:35) - And I know you talk about that a lot, knowing who your ideal buyer is, knowing as much as you can about them. And then we talk about moose bait, what will attract that moose to you. And so that's exactly what you're doing. You're telling them what you can do for them. And that's resonating with people. And they are reaching out to you, which is like you said, it all starts with a conversation. So that's brilliant.
Speaker 3 (00:10:02) - So I just want to reframe rather than telling them what you can do for them. Show that. Right. So teach them. Most of our about section will end up with this is how we help. But it starts with almost like,, a vendor agnostic list of insights. So it's not we help people do this, but this is what you need to do in order to succeed. And then we say we do that. So that their first,, experience is learning. Which earns us the right to ask for the conversation.
Speaker 2 (00:10:42) - That's that's a great distinction.
Speaker 2 (00:10:43) - So you are giving them value upfront. You're not just saying we will help you or this is what we can do with you. You're you're giving them a nugget that they're saying, wow. If like you said, if I can learn that from her profile, what can I learn if we have a conversation? So I like that you made that distinction.
Speaker 3 (00:11:01) - And we'll say before telling them how you can help them, actually help them.
Speaker 2 (00:11:05) - Right. There you go. It boils it down before telling them how you can help them, actually help them. You know, one quote that we talked about before the interview, I want to talk, I want to mention because I just think this is brilliant. It applies to this whole, you know, like you said, overarching theme of what we're talking about. Your quote is detach from what the prospect is worth to us and attach to what we are worth to the prospect.
Speaker 3 (00:11:35) - Yeah. And I think that kind of flows smoothly from what we were just talking about.
Speaker 3 (00:11:39) - It's just bring value when you come in to have a conversation with someone and you're thinking, this is a lead you're gonna lose every single time when you come into a good, this is a person I'd love to have a conversation with, maybe bring some value to and explore if there's an opportunity down the road. All of a sudden that not just is your mind mindset shifted, but the way you approach your prospect shifts. The way they feel about you shifts when you jump into a pitch too soon, they feel like just they're another number, right? Who wants to be pitched or pitched all the time on LinkedIn? At this point, I feel like a victim of being pitched, so I don't want to be the victimizer. So my goal on LinkedIn is to bring as much value to as many people that can benefit from what I do. And follow up and have conversations with them to bring more value. And lead to an opportunity. So I'm not leading with the opportunity. I'm leading two of the opportunities.
Speaker 2 (00:12:54) - That's a very good way to put it. And,, another thing I like that you said is to engage with people who are posting content. As you said, it's all about us, right?, I've had people reach out to me. Of course, we've all just been pitch slapped over and over and over over zoom. But. But someone who says, hey, I just purchased your book and read it, and I love these points in your book. I'm like, you know, bingo, I want to talk to you. And so the more you can make it about the other person, the better. And I'll give.
Speaker 3 (00:13:28) - You a great.
Speaker 2 (00:13:29) - Example. No go ahead.
Speaker 3 (00:13:30) - Sample could be let's say and and you have a book. And I love that you have an amazing book. But most people don't have books. Right. So what are they doing? They're sharing other people's content. So let's say K you go out and you share Brené Brown post and I love Brene Brown. I don't know if you love reading.
Speaker 3 (00:13:49) - Oh, we all love Brené Brown. Brown. It's like Oprah, right? Yeah, everyone loves Oprah. Everyone loves Brene Brown. Right? That's kind of like the thing. So love her. All right. So you share a post and now I go and they find the podcast Brené Brown was on, maybe one that she was on with Oprah. I don't know. Right now I find the post and I come back to you right? And I say, K, I engage on your post, I talk on the comments. My number one takeaway from this, Brené Brown, is this. And now I connect with you. Okay, I really loved the post you put out from Brené Brown. I'm not sure if you heard her on the podcast two weeks ago, but if you're open to connecting, I'd be happy to send you that link. And so now we're starting a conversation that has nothing to do with LinkedIn treating. It's about the topic. So that's where I'm detaching from what you are worth to me as a prospect and attaching to what I could be worth to you and you.
Speaker 3 (00:14:44) - Like Brené Brown, I'm going to give you more Brené Brown right, so we can act. And then, you know, and we start in conversation. So another thing we say all the time is treat the person on the other side of the message the same way you would if they were on the other side of the table. I would not introduce myself. Shake your hand, send you a business card and then say, you know, let let's do business together. There's no what we would do. We would have small talk. We get to know each other. I learn what matters to you, and it would lead to an opportunity potentially,, where I might be able to bring value. Or maybe you bring value to me because I'm detached from selling you. So I'm open to all things right.
Speaker 1 (00:15:26) - Today's podcast is sponsored by the acclaimed book Unstoppable Sales Secrets How to Create an Unfair Advantage and Outsell Your Competition by Kay Miller. If you want to make more sales, you need to read this book.
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Speaker 3 (00:15:51) - And that takes a little bit more work.
Speaker 2 (00:15:54) - It takes a lot more work. And I think that speaks to what we talked about before, about knowing your ideal prospect. You can't sell everyone and you can't be a value in service to everyone. So you need to do your homework and say, okay, is this someone that I can help and that that, you know, possibly can help me? Like you said, I always forget how to say that word.
Speaker 3 (00:16:16) - Oh, reciprocation. The reciprocity.
Speaker 2 (00:16:21) - Reciprocity.
Speaker 3 (00:16:23) - And.
Speaker 2 (00:16:24) - Reciprocity we're talking about. If you do something for someone, we naturally the other person wants to do something for you. So by really engaging in what is important to them, you have an edge for sure. But it does take more time. So how do you go about deciding who you who that's worth doing for?
Speaker 3 (00:16:45) - Well. So, I mean, I have my ways.
Speaker 3 (00:16:47) - Use our sales navigator, which we could talk a little bit about, to really hone down to exactly the types of people that I want to have conversations with. So it's not like I'm out there giving all my insights away to the whole world and very purposeful in who I'm approaching and who I'm having conversations with, because I know who I can bring the most value to. Right. So and you can do this by categories. Maybe this week I'm going to do bankers. And then next week I'm going to do insurance brokers. And then in the following week I'll do mortgage people right. Like you can find you can run. And I hate to use the word campaigns, but in campaigns I've got really great content for a particular industry, and maybe it's phenomenal content just as an opportunity to engage all of those people, because I'm leading with content that is valuable to them. So a lot of times it just depends on that. Another thing that it might happen, you know, how do you determine his I know my ideal prospect.
Speaker 3 (00:17:53) - And I've got a client that just told me how amazing I was and was just a whole lot of fun. And thank you. Now I'm going to search their connections for all the types of people I might want to have a conversation with. And you know, I'll say, hey, Mr. Klein, I you know, I'm so glad we've been able to help you do X, Y, and Z. I hope you don't mind, but I noticed you're connected to 12 people on LinkedIn. I'd love to get in front of. Can I run these names by you? And it might get two, 3 or 4 introductions from,, right. And so there are a lot of different ways to approach business development., but when it comes. When you have to really get good at searching for your ideal persona and what you can't do on LinkedIn. So it's funny. I'll get on a call with a client first meeting. We're getting on a coaching call, and one of the first questions I want to know is who do you serve? And sometimes they'll say women between the ages of 45 and 65 and this and that and and I'm like, so here's the thing with LinkedIn.
Speaker 3 (00:18:58) - That's not a cert. But what we can do potentially is find professionals that have been in business more than ten years that have. So we and that's like a sales navigator filter so we can identify. But we have to use LinkedIn filters. So it's a different persona. So you can build out this is my ideal client that drives, you know a $50,000 car and does they know all these things. But that's not going to help you with LinkedIn. So what you need to do is take kind of drill down all the filters on LinkedIn and go, oh yeah, that matches my persona and that matches my persona. And then and we start with the largest list of everyone, and then we drill it down and drill it down and drill it down. So I think that was a long answer to your question.
Speaker 2 (00:19:48) - No, but it makes me even more intrigued. Is there a way, besides working with Brynn Tillman, which will put all that information in the show notes?, is there a way to explore what LinkedIn's filters are? Yeah.
Speaker 3 (00:20:03) - So if you go to your search bar at the very top, stick in your cursor and hit enter, you're going to have a whole world of filters go all the way to the right hand side, and there's an all filters button. And how about it, man? It's a lot of fun.
Speaker 2 (00:20:18) - Well, that's good because like you said, we might define our ideal target market, our moose, by our standards, our lingo, our parameters. But you know, interesting that you point out that might not mean anything on LinkedIn. So if you are attracting prospects in LinkedIn, you need to know that, right?, another point you know, you make, which I'm guilty of this too, and I'm working on it. And that is that a lot of us are lurkers. That does not apply to you. You post a ton of content and you post engaging content. You do LinkedIn lives. I think that's something that the average person in sales or who is involved in sales overlooks how powerful that is to post your own content.
Speaker 2 (00:21:03) - And it can take some,, guts to do that, especially if you do video. But providing value to your perfect audience is going to attract them, right?
Speaker 3 (00:21:14) - Absolutely. But just posting it isn't enough. You have to get it into there. And so at the bottom of every piece of every time you share content, there's a little paper airplane and you can send it up to ten people blind copied at a time or one at a time. But if I put out a video, I'm going to go to my warmest, warmest market and ask for their engagement. But then I also may go to the next level and say, this is a topic that, you know, a lot of moose, you know, moose like, you know John, right? Oh, I, I'm struggling with the plural, but I think a moose, I think.
Speaker 2 (00:21:51) - We just say moose for one or moose for a bunch of.
Speaker 3 (00:21:54) - Moose. That's what I thought. Okay, great. So, you know, moose, like, you typically have a, you know, a strong perspective on this topic.
Speaker 3 (00:22:03) - I'd be honored if you'd share yours in comments. So now I can go out and start to ask perspective. You know, the and this is only my first degree connections. But this is a way of nurturing them and staying in front of them is asking them their thoughts. Now they're gonna consume your content because how could they give you their perspective if they don't? And you know, and so it's this big win, right? And then you're very grateful for their insights and how much that's helping the rest of the community. And they now learn your perspective too. So it starts deeper conversations where there's opportunity.
Speaker 2 (00:22:40) - Well, and everyone likes to be asked their perspective, you know, what do you think about that? Who doesn't want to answer that question? Right. And it makes us feel like we're helping, we're contributing. And we are., when you say you asked for their engagement,, do you direct message them or you said, yeah. Yes. Okay.
Speaker 3 (00:22:59) - The bottom at the bottom, if you click on the send button, it's a paper airplane.
Speaker 3 (00:23:03) - It's at the bottom of every piece of content that a person shares. Not always on a company page content. If a person shares it, it's there. If you click on that, you're going to get a list of every single one of your question. You can type in their name and click in a little box, and you can actually send up to ten blind copies. So if I have a list of my ten moose and I could go, you know, in comments, I can't use a name because it's blind copy. But I could say as a moose in this industry, I would love your your perspective. It feels very personal. Even though it went to ten people they don't know. It's blind copied., but now you're engaging or you're getting engagement from these folks in a way that's meaningful to them, because asking them their perspective is a good content. They feel important. You've elevated their voice and they've consumed your content, and they may even look at your profile because you've asked this.
Speaker 3 (00:24:01) - So there's no better way to get someone to consume your content than ask them their perspective on your content. And then they're really listening to it because they've got to add their thought.
Speaker 2 (00:24:10) - Right. That's right. They have to actually read what you're saying or listen. Right, right. That I love that. And I talked to you before we started recording. I said, I want specifics, things that people will take notes about that they can actually act on. And those are some excellent, excellent suggestions. I think that we do get caught up in the numbers. I noticed, of course, when I look at your profile that you've got 66,000,, connections and followers and I'm like, wow, that's a lot. You know, I don't have that many. But you know, when you talk about engaging, reaching out to ten people, if they're ten of the right people, then that's what really matters. So even if you don't have a ton of connections, you can do a lot. And I'm I'm sure you agree.
Speaker 2 (00:24:56) - Right. What is your perspective on that?
Speaker 3 (00:24:58) - And quality over quantity for sure. I mean, I've been doing this a really long time and I do it for a living and I you max out at 30,000 connections and then everyone else becomes a follower., but, you know, if you have 500 of the right people, it's worth way more than 500,000 of the wrong one. So intention is really valuable. Unfortunately or fortunately, whatever. You know, I started early and I was a LinkedIn open networker for a couple of years and before I even really knew how to leverage the platform well. So I have a ton of people that are not the right people, and that doesn't help. It really doesn't know. A lot of my cohorts would say,, their colleagues would say, well, it opens up new markets for you. But if I were to do it over, I would be much more intentional in how I build my network.
Speaker 2 (00:25:51) - Okay. Are you taking notes? You the listener? Because I sure am that that is a great point.
Speaker 2 (00:25:57) - Like I said, I think we get intimidated when we see someone with all these followers. And you're saying, no, I would have been more intentional with this process. I also interviewed someone,, recently who has a ton over 100,000 followers, and she said, also, I don't know how many of those were even real., do you think that there is a problem with bots and fake followers on LinkedIn? I think there was.
Speaker 3 (00:26:24) - And I think LinkedIn did a really good job,, cleaning them up. I had 69,000 followers and now I have 66,000 followers. So LinkedIn really, I think, did a deep dive into and and scrubbed right before they hit a billion,, members. They scrubbed it like they're all over the billion and they just scrubbed it. And now they're down to 950 million. And I think it was very intentional because they wanted it to be a real 1 billion. So,, either is very little value in following someone. So why there would be fake followers is a little beyond me.
Speaker 3 (00:27:00) - Fake connections is a little different, potentially., but you can search your followers and I can. I can search anyone's followers. Those are public information, even if I'm not connected to them. So when you go into that search filter, they talked about the magic, and then you go and put your cursor in the search bar, hit enter, go to all filters. One of the filters is followers of. So if I want to see all the people following Brené Brown, I can. And if I want to drill that to only the followers that are people that are following Brené Brown that are in the industry of loose, I can do that, right? I can I can really drill it down. And now I can see all the CEOs in the New York metropolitan area that follow Brené Brown, that I want to invite to a motivational talk that I'm giving. And I they love, they like her. They're gonna like me, right? You know? But. Right. But I can do that.
Speaker 3 (00:27:52) - And so I can really drill down based on followers of. So if she wants to know who her followers are, she can search through just followers, not connection.
Speaker 2 (00:28:03) - I love that so I'm so can you do that then with a regular LinkedIn account, do you need premium or sales navigator for that? Nope. Okay, so you can do that. You who are listening can do that right now. I'm I can't wait to get off this call. Brian. We might have to end early just because I'm so excited.
Speaker 3 (00:28:20) - Do it again in the future.
Speaker 2 (00:28:22) - Yeah, we might have to do another episode because we are close to being out of time. But I do want to talk about ChatGPT, which we briefly talked about. And, you know, this is a new world for so many people, someone like you who are just immersed in this world, I mean, a super early adopter of LinkedIn and, you know, leading edge with a lot of different technologies. I know you're using that, but the average person who's, you know, involved in their sales role or running their business all.
Speaker 2 (00:28:51) - All of those things that they have are not so familiar with this. So why don't you give us a couple tips about how the average person in sales or business can leverage that?
Speaker 3 (00:29:02) - Oh I know, big question. I know that's like that's like, okay,, give me directions for the Earth.
Speaker 2 (00:29:09) - No. I'm sorry. Okay.
Speaker 3 (00:29:11) - So let's just start with GPT, the large language,, technology that literally you can ask you questions and it will give you answers, but it is as fallible as the information that's been given. So as we give it information, it is learning from everyone globally using it, which means a lot of what it's learning is wrong. So just take that into consideration as we're using ChatGPT. So the number one. Tip that I am giving right now and it may change in a year, is do not use it to research anything. Use it based on your own voice, your own words. So we're in sales. Were talkers. Jump on zoom. Record yourself. You could go I on my phone.
Speaker 3 (00:30:00) - If I'm walking, I do,, talk to text. You could do what right. Get your voice in text. So take the transcript. Now go into ChatGPT. And everything you do in a chat is based on my transcript. So use this transcript only. Do not. Research is almost in every single thing that I do. Do not research okay. So now we've taught it. These are the only words or the only concepts to use. And it will learn over and over to over time that this is your voice. Now what do we do? We can ask it to write,, an email campaign so you can say to it,, you know, I am a sales person. I sell to this kind of moose in this kind of market., I want to I want a three drip email campaign. The first one, I want to bring extreme value. The second one, I want their opinion. And the third one is an offer. Here's the transcript. Go. And now you'll get it.
Speaker 3 (00:31:05) - That's one thing. Now I can say. Here's the transcript. Write me a 200 word post for LinkedIn. Here's the transcript. Pull out five quotes that I can use on LinkedIn. Right. So I can now here's the transcript. Give me a LinkedIn poll I have the right prompt for that. So from that three minute text to talk talk to text or transcript from your your zoom, you can have all the content in your voice. So that's my, my main tip.
Speaker 2 (00:31:39) - Well those are very very powerful. And yes. And you can also you know if you right, you know, you might want to speak it and have it transcribed which there are so many options. Now I use descript., you mentioned otter AI. There's so many different ways to get things transcribed, but you can also write something and then say, okay, summarize this, make it into bullet points, pull out quotes, all of these different things. It's just it's just a brave new world. And yes, in some ways it's scary.
Speaker 2 (00:32:08) - But if you're not using AI, you are falling behind because your competitor is right 100%.
Speaker 3 (00:32:15) - Yeah. Got it. For the people that are afraid that AI is going to take over their role, it won't if you take over AI.
Speaker 2 (00:32:22) - I love that you've got a lot of good,, Bryn isms. So that's a great place to end. This has been an action packed half hour. Brin Tillman, thank you so much for being on the podcast.
Speaker 3 (00:32:37) - Thank you for having me. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 1 (00:32:41) - Thanks for listening to this episode of Unstoppable Women in Sales, your source for secrets you can use to make more sales. Check the show notes for links and contact information, and if you enjoyed the podcast, please spread the word by subscribing, sharing and leaving a five star review. You can always learn more by going to UN Copyable sales company cast. Until next time, go out and supercharge your sales like a true unstoppable rock star.